Ill Conceived

Viktor Orbán: The B-Side (PREVIEW)

THIS IS A PREVIEW OF A BONUS B-SIDE EPISODE. For access to the full length version of this and every other biweekly bonus B-side, go to Patreon.com/illconceived
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This one's mostly about Rod Dreher. We also read your letters about:
Performing sex live on stage (this is a reminder to get your tickets to Thursday's Chicago live show!)
Why grandparents can't retire
The mechanics of Orbán's Home Building Allowance for Families policy and its longer-term impacts on the Hungarian housing market
The overlap between Fidesz and the Heritage Foundation, as well as their connecting link: the Danube Institute

Viktor Orbán

***TICKETS TO OUR JULY 2 SHOW IN CHICAGO ARE ON SALE! GET YOUR TICKETS NOW BY CLICKING HERE!!!!***
While natalism as a political project has its proponents, few heads of state have been willing to attempt to use the full force of the state to raise birth rates. However, one leader does stand out: Hungary's recently-ousted prime minister, Viktor Orbán. This week, June and Josh take a look at Orban's 16-year term as PM, the effects of his policies, and the ways that right-wing authoritarianism in Europe both mirrors and partners with similar movements in the United States.
***WANT MORE ILL CONCEIVED? Every other week, we release B-side supplements to the main episodes where we read your e-mail responses and discuss things further. Come check us out at Patreon.com/illconceived!***
***WE WANT YOUR THOUGHTS FOR THE WORLD FAMOUS MAILBAG! Send an email with feedback about this week's episode to illconceivedpod@gmail.com***
EPISODE ART: Viktor Orbán, the former prime minister of Hungary.
AUDIO CLIPS:
1:08:34 – Marco Rubio speaking in Budapest in February 2026, declaring a "golden era" in relations between Hungary and the United States
1:14:09 – JD Vance calling Donald Trump at an April 2026 Viktor Orban election rally in Budapest
SOURCES:
How Viktor Orban hollowed out Hungary’s democracy
How Viktor Orbán’s Hungary Eroded the Rule of Law and Free Markets
Hungary’s opposition struggles to beat Viktor Orban’s stealth autocracy
Home Building Allowance for Families
Viktor Orban’s pro-natalist policies are not working
In a state of necessity. How has Orban changed Hungary
Hungary passes constitutional amendment to ban LGBTQ+ public events
Hungary Ends Legal Recognition for Transgender and Intersex People
Hungary’s ongoing demographic decline: an increase in birth rates is the only hope
Authoritarian Populism in Disguise: Orbán’s Anti-Worker ‘Pro-Worker’ Regime
Hungary races to build border fence as migrants keep coming
Orbán rejects the European Union’s migration agreement and defends keeping asylum seekers out of EU territory
Conference of U.S. conservatives opens in Orban’s Hungary
Hungary offered €30,000 to couples having 3 kids—but its birth rate has still fallen to a record monthly low
Vance, after rallying in Hungary for Orban, says he wasn’t surprised by the autocrat’s defeat
Hungary: Prime Minister Viktor Orbán announced a seven-point family protection action plan
Hungary’s New Leader Reveals Viktor Orbán Was Paying CPAC 
Here's why American conservatives are heading to Hungary for a big conference
At CPAC, Hungary’s Orban decries LGBTQ+ rights, migration 
What one country's experiment says about attempts to boost birth rates 
Farewell To Hungary, And To Europe
FOLLOW THE SHOW:
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FOLLOW JOSH:
Website: joshboerman.com
Bluesky: @bosh.worstpossible.world
Other podcast: The Worst of All Possible Worlds
Stream: Traditional Scrench
FOLLOW JUNE:
Bluesky: @junlper.beer
Other podcast: Kill The Computer
Writing: June's Substack
ILL CONCEIVED THEME SONG BY: Caleb (Linktree / Bluesky)

Simone & Malcolm Collins: The B-Side (PREVIEW)

THIS IS A PREVIEW OF A BONUS B-SIDE EPISODE. For access to the full length version of this and every other biweekly bonus B-side, go to Patreon.com/illconceived
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We weren't able to cover everything we wanted to discuss about the Collins family in the main episode, so this week we dug in for a look at the Based Camp Discord community, the Collins Institute's bespoke homeschool learning management system Parrhesia.io, and Malcom's attempt at crafting a core family theology.
Plus, we read your letters about:
Josh blowing it on knowing anything about Lord of the Rings
The sociopolitical context of the University of St Andrews in Scotland
The creative output of genetic dead-enders like us

UPDATE: Chicago Live Show Postponed to July 2

Josh got sick and had to go to the hospital, so we're postponing our Chicago live show to Thursday, July 2. Here's the link to the new event: https://www.eventbrite.com/e/ill-conceived-podcast-live-in-chicago-one-night-only-70226-tickets-1990032806695?aff=oddtdtcreator
Previous ticket buyers should have already received a refund and a link to rebook their tickets; please let us know if you experience any issues with that. Thank you for your understanding and we'll see you in a month!

Simone & Malcolm Collins

In mainstream media coverage of natalism, one specific couple keeps popping up. Their eccentric appearance and apparent ironclad commitment to the principles of tech natalism make them catnip to curious reporters, who have profiled them exhaustively. But who are Simone and Malcolm Collins, and what are they actually trying to sell you? This week, Josh and June do their best to find out.
***GET TICKETS TO JOSH'S SHOW IN CINCINNATI HERE AND THE ILL CONCEIVED JUNE 4TH LIVE SHOW IN CHICAGO HERE!!!***
***WANT MORE ILL CONCEIVED? Every other week, we release B-side supplements to the main episodes where we read your e-mail responses and discuss things further. Come check us out at Patreon.com/illconceived!***
***WE WANT YOUR THOUGHTS FOR THE WORLD FAMOUS MAILBAG! Send an email with feedback about this week's episode to illconceivedpod@gmail.com***
EPISODE ART: Malcolm and Simone Collins in a press photo by Hannah Yoon
AUDIO CLIPS:
18:35 – Simone Collins in a YouTube video entitled "Are You an Ambivert?" originally uploaded in November 2011
24:15 – Simone performing a cover of the Firefly theme song in a video originally uploaded to YouTube in July 2011
46:59 – Simone introduces Malcolm to the channel in a video originally uploaded to YouTube in November 2014 
1:00:08 – Malcolm and Simone discuss "A Pragmatist's Take on the Red Pill" originally uploaded to YouTube in March 2020
1:16:46 – The introduction to the Based Camp episode "One Conspiracy Explains All Modern Culture (This Explains EVERYTHING)" originally uploaded to YouTube in May 2026
1:20:09 – The Bort license plate scene from "Itchy And Scratchy Land" (The Simpsons, S06E04)
SOURCES:
"How I Proposed to My Girlfriend on Reddit" by Malcolm Collins (Huffington Post, August 6, 2013)
ArtCorgi's profile on Crunchbase
"Why Many Entrepreneurs Are Turning to a ‘Search-Fund’ Model" by Glenn Hunter (D Magazine, January 9, 2017)
"Scoop: Dialog, a secretive forum, plans D.C.-area campus" by Mike Allen (Axios, August 7, 2025)
Simone's LinkedIn profile
Malcolm's LinkedIn profile
Simone's Reddit account
Malcolm's Reddit account
"Meet the ‘elite’ couples breeding to save mankind" by Io Dodds (The Telegraph, April 19, 2023)
"About Simone and Malcolm Collins’ Smear Campaign Against Me" by Lyman Stone (Medium post, October 22, 2024)
"America’s premier pronatalists on having ‘tons of kids’ to save the world: ‘There are going to be countries of old people starving to death’" by Jenny Kleeman (The Guardian, May 25, 2024)
Based Camp on YouTube
FOLLOW THE SHOW:
Website: illconceivedpodcast.com
Bluesky: ‪@illconceivedpodcast.com
Tumblr: @illconceivedpod
FOLLOW JOSH:
Website: joshboerman.com
Bluesky: @bosh.worstpossible.world
Other podcast: The Worst of All Possible Worlds
Stream: Traditional Scrench
FOLLOW JUNE:
Bluesky: @junlper.beer
Other podcast: Kill The Computer
Writing: June's Substack
ILL CONCEIVED THEME SONG BY: Caleb (Linktree / Bluesky)

ANNOUNCEMENT: Ill Conceived Gives You The Talk

Thursday, June 4 at 7pm / Lincoln Lodge, Chicago
$20 per ticket / 50 tickets only
https://www.eventbrite.com/e/ill-conceived-podcast-live-in-chicago-one-night-only-60426-tickets-1990032806695?aff=oddtdtcreator

JD Vance: The B-Side (PREVIEW)

THIS IS A PREVIEW OF A BONUS B-SIDE EPISODE. For access to the full length version of this and every other biweekly bonus B-side, go to Patreon.com/illconceived
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The natalist arguments of people like JD Vance are increasingly being used to defend new laws rolling back bodily autonomy, and in Wyoming, a newly signed "fetal heartbeat" bill has made this connection explicit. We're talking about it, plus we read your mail about:
The tendencies of fundamentalist Catholicism vs. more mainstream Catholicism and the people they tend to attract
The varying cultural tendences of different ethnic Catholic traditions
JD's connection to Erika Kirk and her whole deal

JD Vance

The Vice President of the United States and his wife Usha are expecting their fourth baby, setting an apparent example for their fellow natalists. But just how intertwined is JD Vance with the natalist movement overall and what does it have to do with Usha’s new podcast about children’s books? This week, June and Josh dig into JD Vance’s history with conservatism and Catholicism to try to figure it out.
***WANT MORE ILL CONCEIVED? Every other week, we release B-side supplements to the main episodes where we read your e-mail responses and discuss things further. Come check us out at Patreon.com/illconceived!***
***WE WANT YOUR THOUGHTS FOR THE WORLD FAMOUS MAILBAG! Send an email with feedback about this week's episode to illconceivedpod@gmail.com***
EPISODE ART: JD Vance in a press photo by Niall Carson for Getty Images. Born in Middletown, Ohio, Vance graduated from Ohio State University and Yale Law School, eventually working under Peter Thiel at Mithril Capital. After being elected to the United States Senate in 2022, Vance was selected by Donald Trump to serve as his running mate for the 2024 presidential election.
AUDIO CLIPS:
18:51 – Donald Trump reading from 2 Corinthians as part of the America Reads the Bible special event
24:51 – JD Vance referring to Democratic opposition as "childless cat ladies"
59:39 – Usha Vance reading The Tale of Peter Rabbit by Beatrix Potter for her podcast Storytime with the Second Lady
SOURCES:
J. D. Vance and the Right’s Call to Have More Babies
The troubling history behind JD Vance's natalism
JD Vance And Peter Thiel: What To Know About The Relationship Between Trump’s VP Pick And The Billionaire
What have I done? I forced my kid to listen to Usha Vance’s podcast - now she’s a fan
JD Vance Repeats ‘Anti-Family’ Criticism of Democrats on Sunday Morning News Show Tour
Baby Bonuses and Motherhood Medals: Why We Shouldn’t Trust the Pronatalist Movement
Trump May Soon Offer a Motherhood Medal, an Idea Popularized in Nazi Germany
Republicans Are Right: One Party Is ‘Anti-Family and Anti-Kid’
Usha Vance and JD Vance, Pronatalism’s Poster Couple, Are Having a 4th Kid
JD Vance’s Approval Rating Plunges to New Historic Low
Mayor Mamdani and Governor Hochul Announce First Four Communities to Receive Free 2-K Seats
Democracy | Of Childless ‘Psychopath’ Women and ‘Replacement’: JD Vance’s Birthrate and Immigration Obsessions Have Shared History
An Analysis of Happy No Snakes Day and the Deeper Implications on the Horizon for Children’s Literature and Christian Nationalist Policies in the Public School System
Beyond the Nuclear Family
The Role of the Nuclear Family in Capitalism
With Defense of ICE, JD Vance Clarifies His Next Target: You
J.D. Vance Used to Be an Atheist. What He Believes Now Is Telling.
Gold Mother's Cross
Wikipedia: Order of Maternal Glory
Who in the USSR was awarded the ‘Mother-Heroine’ title?
National Conservatism: A Statement of Principles
5% of People Detained By ICE Have Violent Convictions, 73% No Convictions
FOLLOW THE SHOW:
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FOLLOW JOSH:
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Bluesky: @bosh.worstpossible.world
Other podcast: The Worst of All Possible Worlds
Stream: Traditional Scrench
FOLLOW JUNE:
Bluesky: @junlper.beer
Other podcast: Kill The Computer
Writing: June's Substack
ILL CONCEIVED THEME SONG BY: Caleb (Linktree / Bluesky)

Ballerina Farm / Hannah Neeleman: The B-Side (PREVIEW)

THIS IS A PREVIEW OF A BONUS B-SIDE EPISODE. For access to the full length version of this and every other biweekly bonus B-side, go to Patreon.com/illconceived
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Fox News has reported on the "problem" of teenagers not getting pregnant anymore. We're talking about it, and reading your letters because it turns out that a lot of you had a lot to say about Hannah Neeleman, including:
The cultural specifics of Mormonism and how they're reflected in Ballerina Farms
The sinister overtones of her husband's whole deal
The economics of farm tourism vs. functional scale farming
Natural births and why many people prefer them
Ballerina Farm-style natalism as a reflection of European settler-colonialism
As always, our babies stay winning!
 

Ballerina Farm / Hannah Neeleman

Natalists have an ideal life and an ideal wife: rugged, individualistic, and dedicated to self-sufficiency. Perhaps nothing epitomizes this ideal better than Ballerina Farm, the popular social media account of dancer and pageant queen Hannah Neeleman that is growing into an influential direct-to-consumer food and lifestyle brand that no longer sells raw milk. This week, Josh and June look at the history of Ballerina Farm and try to understand how its strange brand of seemingly apolitical tradwifery serves as a stalking horse for the natalist movement and reactionary politics more broadly.
CHECK OUT OUR RECENT PODCAST GUEST APPEARANCES!
June on Anime Sickos
Josh on Lions Led By Donkeys
Josh on Well There's Your Problem
***WANT MORE ILL CONCEIVED? Every other week, we release B-side supplements to the main episodes where we read your e-mail responses and discuss things further. Come check us out at Patreon.com/illconceived!***
***WE WANT YOUR THOUGHTS FOR THE WORLD FAMOUS MAILBAG! Send an email with feedback about this week's episode to illconceivedpod@gmail.com***
EPISODE ART: Hannah Neeleman in a professional headshot. After graduating from Juilliard's dance undergraduate program while pregnant, Neeleman moved to Brazil then back home to Utah, where she and her husband Daniel purchased a farm along the east side of the Wasatch Range. Her Instagram account Ballerina Farm has over 10 million followers.
AUDIO CLIPS:
1:01:48 – "Strength at Every Stage" protein powder advertisement from Ballerina Farm
1:27:12 – Response to the Sunday Times article from the Ballerina Farm Instagram account
SOURCES:
Ballerina Farm website
Ballerina Farm Instagram
“Meet the queen of the ‘trad wives’ (and her eight children)” by Megan Agnew (The Sunday Times, July 20, 2024)
“She Gave Birth Two Weeks Ago. Now She’s in a Beauty Pageant” by Madison Malone Kircher (The New York Times, January 30, 2024)
“Tycoon or Tradwife? The Woman Behind Ballerina Farm Makes Her Own Path” by Julia Moskin (The New York Times, December 3, 2024)
“The Business of Ballerina Farm” by Liz Flora (Business of Fashion, May 27, 2025)
“When Ballerina Farm Comes to Town” by Erica Schwiegershausen (The Cut, September 10, 2025)
“Park City Creamery to sell business to Ballerina Farm” by Katie Hatzfeld (The Park Record, December 23, 2025)
“Ballerina Farm pauses raw milk sales after samples fail health tests” by Grace Doerfler (KPCW, January 29, 2026)
Hannah Neeleman’s feature spread in Evie magazine
“Audio Recording From Ballerina Farm Times Interview Exposes Dishonest Journalism” by Nicole Dominique (Evie, July 29, 2024)
FOLLOW THE SHOW:
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FOLLOW JOSH:
Website: joshboerman.com
Bluesky: @bosh.worstpossible.world
Other podcast: The Worst of All Possible Worlds
Stream: Traditional Scrench
FOLLOW JUNE:
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Other podcast: Kill The Computer
Writing: June's Substack
ILL CONCEIVED THEME SONG BY: Caleb (Linktree / Bluesky)