Ill Conceived

What is Childhood?

The White House will likely soon release a large set of documents about convicted pedophile and human trafficker Jeffrey Epstein further detailing the depths of his crimes. Alongside this, a line of rhetoric seems to be developing in certain right-wing circles: although what Epstein did was morally abominable, not all of it was criminal, and it's certainly categorically different from preying on "real children." But what exactly is childhood, and why are certain reactionaries making this argument now? This week, June and Josh look into the history of the concept of childhood in the United States to try and figure out why.
***REMINDER: WE HAVE A PATREON NOW! We record bonus mailbag episodes and release them at the beginning of each week. Come check us out at Patreon.com/illconceived!***
***WE WANT YOUR THOUGHTS FOR THE MAILBAG! Send an email with feedback about this week's episode to illconceivedpod@gmail.com***
EPISODE ART: Richard Hanania, a writer and online right-wing personality whose work includes 2023's The Origins of Woke, published by HarperCollins under their Broadside Books imprint. Hanania is a co-author of Project 2025, previously wrote for white supremacists publications under the pen name Richard Hoste, and recently wrote about how pedophilia is a moral panic.
AUDIO CLIPS:
3:11 – Megyn Kelly speaking about Jeffrey Epstein in a recent episode of The Megyn Kelly Show
1:05:01 – "Jailbait," a song released by Olivia Nuzzi under the pseudonym "Livvy" in 2009 when she was 16 years old
1:14:32 – Neil Sedaka performs "Happy Birthday Sweet Sixteen" on American Bandstand in 1963
FURTHER LISTENING:
The Worst of All Possible Worlds episode about Fireproof (Apple Podcasts / Spotify / Pocket Casts)
SOURCES:
Republican Wants to Loosen Child Labor Laws
Why is the teen birth rate falling?
Child Labor Laws - Facts and Misconceptions
Injuries, death and abuse: The disturbing reality behind Ohio’s rollback child labor laws
A Brief History of Education in the United States
Epstein files: Who else was mentioned?
Hulk Hogan Awarded $115 Million in Privacy Suit Against Gawker
The U.S. Fertility Decline Is Not Due to the Drop in Teen Pregnancies
Age of Consent Through the Years in the United States.
Hitler, Demi Moore, and Other "Pedophiles"
FOLLOW THE SHOW:
Website: illconceivedpodcast.com
Bluesky: ‪@illconceivedpodcast.com
Tumblr: @illconceivedpod
FOLLOW JOSH:
Website: joshboerman.com
Bluesky: @bosh.worstpossible.world
Other podcast: The Worst of All Possible Worlds
Stream: Traditional Scrench
FOLLOW JUNE:
Bluesky: @junlper.beer
Other podcast: Kill The Computer
Writing: June's Substack
ILL CONCEIVED THEME SONG BY: Caleb (Linktree / Bluesky)

Matthew Yglesias: One Billion Americans: The B-Side (PREVIEW)

THIS IS A PREVIEW OF A BONUS B-SIDE EPISODE. For access to the full length version of this and every other biweekly bonus B-side, go to Patreon.com/illconceived
--------------------------
Dr. Oz expects a Trump baby boom in 2026. We're talking about it.
Plus, we read your mail from the Matt Yglesias episode, including:
Regional visas in Australia and how they compare to Matt Yglesias's city visa concept
The U.S. economy's shift toward health care as a core industry in response to an aging population
Large families as a status signifier
The difference between a Park & Ride and a Kiss & Ride

Balaji Srinivasan & Network Natalism

Natalcon 2025 featured a number of high profile speakers whose speeches weren't recorded. One of these speakers was Balaji Srinivasan, a technologist who made his fortune in pre-pregnancy genetic testing and now preaches the gospel of cryptocurrency and decentralized "Network States" to anyone who will listen. This week, Josh and June discover what Balaji's whole deal is and end up deeply confused and repulsed by it.
***REMINDER: WE HAVE A PATREON NOW! We record bonus mailbag episodes and release them at the beginning of each week. Come check us out at Patreon.com/illconceived!***
***WE WANT YOUR THOUGHTS FOR THE MAILBAG! Send an email with feedback about this week's episode to illconceivedpod@gmail.com***
EPISODE ART: Balaji Srinavasan at TechCrunch Disrupt. After graduating from Stanford and co-founding genetic testing company Counsyl, Srinivasan joined the venture capital firm Andreesen Horowitz and later worked at Coinbase. In 2024 he founded Network School, an incubator in Malaysia that seeks to develop applications for his concept of the Network State.
AUDIO CLIPS:
48:23 – Balaji Srinivasan's "Ultimate Exit" talk at Y Combinator Startup School in 2013
51:56 – ibid.
1:04:11 – Balaji Srinivasan's talk at Natal Conference 2023
1:10:45 – Balaji Srinivasan at Token2049 in Dubai, 2025
1:20:29 – ibid.
1:22:17 – ibid.
SOURCES:
SAAWA 2013 Honorees profile of Dr. Bhavani Srinivasan
"NY Physician is Fellow of Royal College of Physicians in London" (The Indian Panorama, July 23, 2016)
PDF of the March 2006 issue of State Magazine
Balaji Srinivasan's LinkedIn profile
Crunchbase profile of Counsyl
MIT Technology Review Innovators Under 35 profile of Balaji Srinivasan
"The Blockchain is the Internet of Money" by Tunku Varadarajan (The Wall Street Journal, September 22, 2017)
"The Turnaround" by Balaji Srinivasan (Medium, April 16, 2018)
Network School website
Praxis Nation website
FOLLOW THE SHOW:
Website: illconceivedpodcast.com
Bluesky: ‪@illconceivedpodcast.com
Tumblr: @illconceivedpod
FOLLOW JOSH:
Website: joshboerman.com
Bluesky: @bosh.worstpossible.world
Other podcast: The Worst of All Possible Worlds
Stream: Traditional Scrench
FOLLOW JUNE:
Bluesky: @junlper.beer
Other podcast: Kill The Computer
Writing: June's Substack
ILL CONCEIVED THEME SONG BY: Caleb (Linktree / Bluesky)

Matthew Yglesias: One Billion Americans

In 2020, Vox cofounder Matt Yglesias published a book entitled One Billion Americans which ostensibly sought to lay out a liberal argument for dramatically increasing the population of the United States. This week, June and Josh read the book. Hoo boy, do we have thoughts about it.
***BIG NEWS: WE HAVE A PATREON NOW! We'll be recording bonus mailbag episodes that will release at the beginning of each week. The main show will continue its regular release schedule at the end of each week and will stay free to all of you, our beloved babies. Come check us out at Patreon.com/illconceived!***
***WE WANT YOUR THOUGHTS FOR THE WEEKLY MAILBAG! Send an email with feedback about this week's episode to illconceivedpod@gmail.com***
EPISODE ART: Matthew Yglesias, the author of One Billion Americans. In 2014, Yglesias cofounded the news website Vox alongside Ezra Klein and Melissa Bell. He departed Vox in 2020 to join the Niskanen Center, a centrist think tank. Yglesias also publishes a newsletter called Slow Boring. 
SOURCES:
One Billion Americans: The Case for Thinking Bigger by Matthew Yglesias (Portfolio, 2020)
“The boring journey of Matt Yglesias” by Dan Zak (Washington Post, January 11, 2023)
A Bluesky post about JD Vance by @helldude.bsky.social
“MTV cancels ‘Ridiculousness’ after 46 seasons, star Rob Dyrdek’s price tag became public” by Taijuan Moorman (USA Today, March 31, 2025)
FOLLOW THE SHOW:
Patreon: Patreon.com/illconceived
Website: illconceivedpodcast.com
Bluesky: ‪@illconceivedpodcast.com
Tumblr: @illconceivedpod
FOLLOW JOSH:
Website: joshboerman.com
Bluesky: @bosh.worstpossible.world
Other podcast: The Worst of All Possible Worlds
Stream: Traditional Scrench
FOLLOW JUNE:
Bluesky: @junlper.beer
Other podcast: Kill The Computer
Writing: June's Substack

Natal Conference 2025

In March 2025, 200 natalists and their closest friends assembled in Austin, Texas for the second gathering of NatalCon, a convention intended to discover the core causes of declining birthrates and come up with solutions to address those problems. This week, Josh and June watched videos recorded from that convention to see what they were cooking. Turns out that it was mostly fascism.
***WE WANT YOUR THOUGHTS FOR THE WEEKLY MAILBAG! Send an email with feedback about this week's episode to illconceivedpod@gmail.com***
EPISODE ART: Kevin Dolan, the founder of Natalcon. Dolan posts on X under the pseudonym "Bennett's Phylactery" and was fired from his position as a data scientist at Booz Allen Hamilton after being doxxed in 2021.
FURTHER READING:
"Surprise! Even Tradwives Like to Share Nudes, Talk About Sex, and Be Single" by Erin Vanderhoof (Vanity Fair, October 21, 2025)
AUDIO CLIPS:
34:48 – Kevin Dolan in his opening remarks at NatalCon 2025
44:02 – Jack Posobiec's speech at NatalCon 2025
47:42 – Carl Benjamin (aka Sargon of Akkad)'s speech at NatalCon 2025
57:45 – Indian Bronson's speech at NatalCon 2025
1:08:56 – Peachy Keenan's speech at NatalCon 2025
1:10:54 – Peachy Keenan's speech at NatalCon 2025, continued
1:17:29 – Carl Benjamin's speech at NatalCon 2025, continued
1:23:29 – Raw Egg Nationalist's speech at NatalCon 2025
1:35:24 – Michael Seifert's speech at NatalCon 2025
1:42:02 – Raw Egg Nationalist's speech at NatalCon 2025, continued
1:48:13 – Carl Benjamin's speech at NatalCon 2025, continued
SOURCES:
The Natal Conference YouTube channel – contains links to all of the speeches mentioned in this episode
“Giving entrepreneurs an 'EXIT' from cancel culture” by Matt Himes (The Blaze, June 7, 2024)
“#4: You're going to be doxxed.” by Kevin Dolan (July 20, 2021)
“The Eugenic Circus Comes to Town” by Brant Bingamon and Maggie Quinlan (The Austin Chronicle, November 2, 2023)
“Revealed: US pro-birth conference’s links to far-right eugenicists” by Jason Wilson (The Guardian, September 4, 2023)
“Tech bros and tradwives are unlikely allies in a little-known movement that’s gaining momentum” by Catherine E. Shoichet, Deborah Brunswick and Meena Duerson (CNN, April 10, 2025)
“Eugenics Controversy Looms Over Natal Conference at UT’s AT&T Center” by Lucciana Choueiry (The Austin Chronicle, March 20, 2025)
“Reflections on Natal-Con” by Bryan Caplan (March 31, 2025)
“They say they want Americans to have more babies. What's beneath the surface?” by Lisa Hagen (NPR, April 25, 2025)

The Good, the Bad and the Mailbag

Next week we're recording our first in-person episode together and Josh is still prepping, so it's time for another mailbag episode. This week's topics include Elon Musk's super-sperm, Warhammer 40K, adoption as a tool of natalism, the pitfalls of accelerated home learning, and how we've discovered the flow and format of the podcast as we've gone along.
***COME SEE JOSH IN CHICAGO THIS MONDAY... Josh will be performing as part of Genius Night: A Night For Geniuses on Monday, October 20 at 7pm... This free event (with a $5 suggested donation) will be at Cafe Mustache, located at 2313 N Milwaukee Avenue... SEE YOU THERE????***
***WE WANT YOUR THOUGHTS FOR THE WEEKLY MAILBAG! Send an email with feedback about this week's episode to illconceivedpod@gmail.com***
EPISODE ART: The cover for the movie The Good, the Bad and the Ugly except it's been edited to say The Good, the Bad and The Mailbag
FURTHER READING:
Law Banning Child Sex Offenders From Homeschooling Stalled After Nine Child Sex Offenders Testify Against It by Tony Delvecchio and Fennick Nym (The Spoon, Belt & Rod, October 9, 2025)
FOLLOW THE SHOW:
Website: illconceivedpodcast.com
Bluesky: ‪@illconceivedpodcast.com
Tumblr: @illconceivedpod
FOLLOW JOSH:
Website: joshboerman.com
Bluesky: @bosh.worstpossible.world
Other podcast: The Worst of All Possible Worlds
Stream: Traditional Scrench
FOLLOW JUNE:
Bluesky: @junlper.beer
Other podcast: Kill The Computer
Writing: June's Substack

Elon Musk

Elon Musk was once hailed as one of the brightest wealthy Americans who was standing up for progressive causes like climate change. Then he threw away that reputation as he rapidly shifted rightward and publicly embraced white nationalist conspiracy theories. This week, June and Josh explore Elon Musk’s under-discussed but high-priority views on birth rates, natalism, the Great Replacement theory, and sexy chatbots.
***WE WANT YOUR THOUGHTS FOR THE WEEKLY MAILBAG! Send an email with feedback about this week's episode to illconceivedpod@gmail.com***
EPISODE ART: Elon Musk, the current wealthiest man in the world and by some metrics the wealthiest man to ever live, wearing a black hat that says DOGE on it. Musk's current net worth is estimated around a half trillion dollars based on his equity positions in Tesla and SpaceX. He also owns X, the social media network formerly known as Twitter.
AUDIO CLIPS:
24:38 – Elon Musk in an interview with WELT Documentary
36:09 – Bob Page, the primary antagonist of the 2000 video game Deus Ex, in one of the game's three endings
58:20 – Elon Musk in an interview with Matteo Salvini, the deputy prime minister of Italy
1:12:09 – Luke Priddy, a YouTube content creator who teaches American English, reviewing Grok's "Ani" persona as a teaching tool
1:18:07 – A demonstration video of "Ani" posted by Elon Musk to his X account on July 18, 2025
SOURCES:
Elon Musk All but Endorses the Great Replacement Conspiracy Theory
All About Elon Musk's Kids: Meet His 14 Children and Their 4 Moms
Elon Musk’s Breeding Spree Is So Much Wilder Than You Thought
The Tactics Elon Musk Uses to Manage His ‘Legion’ of Babies—and Their Mothers
Elon Musk Says Shrinking Birth Rates Keep Him Up at Night
Elon Musk thinks the population will collapse. Demographers say it’s not happening
Vivian Jenna Wilson on Being Elon Musk’s Estranged Daughter, Protecting Trans Youth and Taking on the Right Online
Elon Musk rescues Babylon Bee
Elon Musk Says Everyone Should Have 'At Least 3 Children' To Save The Human Race — But Studies Show It Costs Up $430,928 To Raise A Kid
How the 'replacement' theory went mainstream on the political right
The father of ‘great replacement’: an ex-socialist French writer
The immigrants you fear are just like your ancestors. Don’t fall for political scare tactics.
How Elon Musk Is Bringing Sexy A.I. Chatbots to the Mainstream
Loneliness is Driving adoption of AI Companions
AI Companions Reduce Loneliness
FOLLOW THE SHOW:
Website: illconceivedpodcast.com
Bluesky: ‪@illconceivedpodcast.com
Tumblr: @illconceivedpod
FOLLOW JOSH:
Website: joshboerman.com
Bluesky: @bosh.worstpossible.world
Other podcast: The Worst of All Possible Worlds
Stream: Traditional Scrench
FOLLOW JUNE:
Bluesky: @junlper.beer
Other podcast: Kill The Computer
Writing: June's Substack

Homeschooling

It's no secret that large families tend to homeschool their children. But why is this their approach of choice, and how does it work? This week, Josh and June take a look at the origin of homeschooling and discover how the Homeschool Legal Defense Association (HSLDA), an advocacy organization founded by homeschool parents, has effectively created a parallel education system in the United States with almost no oversight or accountability.
***WE WANT YOUR THOUGHTS FOR THE WEEKLY MAILBAG! Send an email with feedback about this week's episode to illconceivedpod@gmail.com***
EPISODE ART: Monica Swanson, a Christian homeschool advocate and author of the books Boy Mom: What Your Son Needs Most from You; Raising Amazing: Bringing Up Kids Who Love God, Like Their Family, and Do The Dishes; and Becoming Homeschoolers: Give Your Kids a Great Education, A Strong Family, and a Life They'll Thank You For Later. Swanson also has hosted podcasts about homeschooling and has four sons. 
AUDIO CLIPS:
42:30 – Monica Swanson, a homeschooling advocate and author of Becoming Homeschoolers, in conversation with Jim Daly on Focus on the Family Radio
1:03:58 – Tiffany Jefferson, a homeschool mom, in a HSLDA promotional video entitled "What Is Freedom For?"
1:20:07 – A promotional video for HSLDA's online academy on their website
FURTHER READING:
"Mechanisms of cultural diversity in urban populations" by Harin Lee, Noric Jacoby, Romain Hennequin & Manuel Moussalam (Nature Communications, 2025) 
"Implicit racial biases are lower in more populous more diverse and less segregated US cities" by Andrew J. Stier, Sina Sajjadi, Fariba Karimi, Luís M. A. Bettencourt & Marc G. Berman (Nature Communications, 2024)
SOURCES:
"A look at homeschooling in the US" by Isabelle Pula (Pew Research Foundation, February 20, 2025)
US National Center for Education Statistics Fast Facts on Homeschooling
Becoming Homeschoolers: Give Your Kids a Great Education, a Strong Family, and a Life They'll Thank You for Later by Monica Swanson (Zondervan, 2024)
"The Dangers of Early Schooling: The Need to Reexamine our Motives and Methods" by Raymond Moore (1973)
Homeschooling: The History and Philosophy of a Controversial Practice by James G. Dwyer and Shawn F. Peters (UChicago Press, 2019)
The Homeschool Choice: Parents and the Privatization of Education by Kate Henley Everett (NYU Press, 2021)
Biography of Michael Farris on the Alliance Defending Freedom website
Generation Joshua website
Homeschool Legal Defense Association website
Archived copy of HSLDA statement on same-sex marriage
Current HSLDA statement opposing the Make Homeschool Safe Act
Center for Responsible Home Education website
FOLLOW THE SHOW:
Website: illconceivedpodcast.com
Bluesky: ‪@illconceivedpodcast.com
Tumblr: @illconceivedpod
FOLLOW JOSH:
Website: joshboerman.com
Bluesky: @bosh.worstpossible.world
Other podcast: The Worst of All Possible Worlds
Stream: Traditional Scrench
FOLLOW JUNE:
Bluesky: @junlper.beer
Other podcast: Kill The Computer
Writing: June's Substack

Moms for Liberty

The COVID-19 pandemic and lockdown created an online ecosystem ripe for misinformation and radicalization. One of the new right wing movements that got its start during this time was the "Parents' Rights" movement, and the group that has pushed this the hardest is Moms For Liberty, who portray themselves as moms standing up for freedom. This week, June and Josh dig into Moms For Liberty to unravel their true agenda and discover how they’ve managed to become an organizing base of the Republican Party in their goal of dismantling the public education system.
***WE WANT YOUR THOUGHTS FOR THE WEEKLY MAILBAG! Send an email with feedback about this week's episode to illconceivedpod@gmail.com***
EPISODE ART: Bridget Ziegler, co-founder of Moms for Liberty and current member of the school board in Sarasota County, Florida. In 2022, Ziegler accepted a director position at the Leadership Institute, a conservative training center in Arlington, VA, but was later forced to resign due to sexual assault allegations involving her, her husband, and an unnamed other woman.
AUDIO CLIPS:
25:18 – Amber Schroeder, a Moms for Liberty chapter leader in Wisconsin, being interviewed for a segment on ABC's Good Morning America
51:47 – Mia Hughes, a Canadian anti-trans advocate, in Moms for Liberty University's YouTube video "Gender 101: Gender Ideology"
57:16 – January Littlejohn, a Florida mother, on the Moms for Liberty "Joyful Warriors" Podcast
FURTHER READING:
Josh interviews 404 Media's Jason Koebler about Facebook AI slop on The Worst of All Possible Worlds (YouTube / Apple Podcasts / Spotify / Pocket Casts)
SOURCES:
Moms for Liberty has turned ‘parental rights’ into a rallying cry for conservative parents
Moms for Liberty’s growth slows again this year
Garland asks FBI to address recent ‘disturbing spike’ in threats against educators
Moms for Liberty candidates won less elections in 2023, but is winning the group’s goal?
Moms for Liberty Has a ‘University.’ What Is It Teaching?
Indiana chapter of Moms for Liberty apologizes for using Hitler quote
Michigan Lawmakers Are Attempting to Ban Porn Entirely
The Roots of Moms for Liberty Run Deeper Than They Think
What we know about the Ziegler sexual assault probe
FOLLOW THE SHOW:
Website: illconceivedpodcast.com
Bluesky: ‪@illconceivedpodcast.com
Tumblr: @illconceivedpod
FOLLOW JOSH:
Website: joshboerman.com
Bluesky: @bosh.worstpossible.world
Other podcast: The Worst of All Possible Worlds
Stream: Traditional Scrench
FOLLOW JUNE:
Bluesky: @junlper.beer
Other podcast: Kill The Computer
Writing: June's Substack

Oh No! More Mailbag

We dug into the mailbag again for thoughts on how natalists pass that shit on, fulfilling or shirking your family’s desires for your life, TeenPact, being a T4T tradwife, the natural gendered division of labor, the impact of benevolent sexism, daddy/daughter dances vs. father/son camping trips, and handing your daughter off to her husband. Our programming will resume as usual next week with an episode on Moms for Liberty, and thank you as always for your continued support.
***WE WANT YOUR THOUGHTS FOR THE WEEKLY MAILBAG! Send an email with feedback about this week's episode to illconceivedpod@gmail.com***
EPISODE ART: The box art for the 1991 Amiga game Oh No! More Lemmings except it's been edited to say "Oh No! More Mailbag"
FURTHER READING:
Sexism Without Hatred?- the psychology of ambivalent sexism
Benevolent Sexism: Psychology of the anti-choice movement (a pro-choice video)
FOLLOW THE SHOW:
Website: illconceivedpodcast.com
Bluesky: ‪@illconceivedpodcast.com
Tumblr: @illconceivedpod
FOLLOW JOSH:
Website: joshboerman.com
Bluesky: @bosh.worstpossible.world
Other podcast: The Worst of All Possible Worlds
Stream: Traditional Scrench
FOLLOW JUNE:
Bluesky: @junlper.beer
Other podcast: Kill The Computer
Writing: June's Substack